Ladder Capital Corp (NYSE:LADR) Q2 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

Stephen Laws: Great. It sounds like a lot in your origination pipeline for consideration. A quick question on the dividend. You’ve significantly over-earned it year-to-date. I imagine very little earnings, if any, are in a TRS given the conduit business is slow, non-existent right now. So can you talk about your flexibility to manage the dividend? How do you think about that to the end of the year as far as what you can spill forward and the rules there? Or do you have any losses you think you may materialize prior to year-end that would reduce that REIT distribution requirement?

Brian Harris: Paul, I don’t know if you want to answer that. I know we went through this a little while ago. But as far – let me answer the back-end questions first. Do – I think there could be a couple of small losses here and there, but nothing that I can even tell you the name of right now and just with rates where they are and the temperature of some of the discussions at extension, you can sense that there’s a little bit of tension in the room. I suspect that’s going on everywhere. But I don’t think that we have a problem complying with REIT rules, which is what I think your question was considering how much we’re out earning the dividend by. And Paul, if you want to talk through that a little bit regarding next year.

Paul Miceli: Yes, I’ll just say, Steve, in high level, we have the ability to carry forward a dividend from last year, some excess that we could use for this year. And bottom line is our REIT taxable income is different than our distributable earnings because we have the ability to deduct depreciation. So it’s not an issue for this year generally.

Stephen Laws: Great. Appreciate the comment. Thank you.

Operator: Thank you. [Operator Instructions] Our next question comes from the line of Steve DeLaney with JMP Securities. Please go ahead.

Steve DeLaney: Thanks. Hello, everyone. Gosh, good questions from Sarah and Stephen. So a lot of the obvious things have been taken. I’m going to kind of pick up on the last point that Stephen mentioned. I think third quarter – you’ve kind of locked your dividend in into 23% in 3Q of last year and totally understandable, given where rates were going and all the uncertainties. I’m just – I’m looking at the balance sheet and year-to-date, your two main categories. Cash has obviously gone up, but loans and securities have come down by over $500 million, and that has caused net interest income to decline in the second quarter, about $2.5 million relative to the first quarter. So if I’m – I’m Paul, and I’m Brian and Pamela and I’m looking at that and I’m on the Board, I’m saying, we know why we’re doing this, but this is not the time to raise our dividend.

So now what I’m hearing today is obviously, you’ve been patient, you’ve taken advantage of the debt repurchases, maybe more capital being deployed over the second half of the year. And I just – I would – I’m here just to kind of like – I applaud everything you’re buying, CLOs, buying back your debt, et cetera. I would just say my message is you’re down to an 8% yield. The stock’s done great. There’s certainly some upside. But I do think the upside in the stock will be tethered to what you’re able to demonstrate in the next two quarters as far as some boost to the dividend. And I guess that’s more of a comment than a question. But as I said, all my questions were covered, happy to – if you have any thoughts on that, Brian, you’d like to share or push back on that at all?